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  1. #1
    james
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    Not dissimilar to another thread...

    I am also looking at buying new skis.

    My current ones are an Atomic SX7. They are solid low-mid intermediate skis and were a good level for me when I got them, but I have outgrown them a bit. I think they are a bit soft, they don't edge too well on ice (apparently thry are normally more for a lighter skier), and with a waist of 64cm are useless in the off piste I am starting to get into.

    I am looking for some 70/30 (roughly) skis - that is, 70% groomed and 30% powder. I haven't really done powder before (tough in Australia I realise) but when the chance is there don't want to have to go and rent skis.

    I am about 6 foot 1 (185cm), 88kgs, reasonably fit and pretty strong build. I ski reasonably aggressively for my level, which is upper-intermediate. I'll hopefully be doing Northern Hemisphere seasons as well for the next few years, so I want some skis that will continue to service me as I (in theory anyway) move slowly into advanced. Cost is not a big issue but I don't want to look like an idiot with flash skis I can't handle. I tend to like doing faster long carving turns but I need to do short turns too and I want to do more work on bumps.

    I don't mind doing the odd jump but don't see myself as getting heavily into the parks.

    I guess I will need a waist of between 76-82mm, and a radius of say 14-16m. Length wise 170-176. I don't know enough about the flex factor to comment on that at this stage.

    Atomic do a fair few skis that seem to fit the criteria (don't know the names sorry - there is a red one, B5 maybe, very wide tip - 132 or so - and maybe 76mm waist so tight radius). Some are wider than others at the end and in the waist. I have heard they can lose their edge faster than other skis but don't know if this is a fair generalisation or not.

    Head have the Monsters plus another that seem to fit the category

    Elan have the magfire, which looks pretty funky.

    Salomon do a few but again I have been warned off them a little.

    Cost is I realise I should road test them first. Most shops will let you demo their top of the range and discount some of the demo cost off the price of the skis, but there seem to be so many to demo.

    I was leaning towards the Head and Elan ones unless anyone has any suggestions.

    Fortunately I work right near the Inski and Readers across the road from each other in the city, so I will come back soon with some suggestions to see if anyone has any comments.

    Thanks for any help.

  2. #2
    Snowatch Patrol Rednut's Avatar
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    From what you are describing, i would say you are looking at the all mountain skis produced by most companies...

    Salomon and Rossi use predominantly foam cores in their all mountain skis which aren't great for heavier people...

    I would start by looking at...
    Atomic - Metron 9. B5 (big heavy ski...)
    Volkl - AC4,
    Stoeckli - Stormrider XL/XXL
    Nordica - Hotrod
    Elan - Magma
    Fischer - AMC 79

    any of these in the sizes range you were talking about would be worth a demo at least...

    Taxman and myself are both on Stormrider XL's i think he has fairly similar dimensions to you... i am shorter and heavier... but still think for what you are after it would be a good ski
    Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in beer!

  3. #3

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    I have Elan M666 and am around the same weight, these day I think thats the Magfire 14????

    I demo'd some Atomic Metron 10's (I think, they were 76mm and 17m turn radius, near identical to the M666 dimensions) and was not impressed with the edge hold.

    Another could be the K2 Apache range or a Vokl AC3, they both make a decent ski, Fischer RC4 would fit the bill of a 70-30 ski I reckon, they are narrow but they are forgiving with excellent edge hold (a great combo!), at least thats what Paul says.....he rabbits on about them nearly as much as I do on the M666's
    *insert witty comment here*

  4. #4
    james
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    Yeah I don't reckon my atomics hold a great edge, but I don't have a lot to compare them with.

    Readers recommended the following two - close to what you guys are saying

    Elan Magfire 14/Magfire Pro - 126-82-109, radius 17.2, 176cm long.

    Volkl AC 40 - 125-82-110 radius 17.8 177cm long.

    The guy in the shop said with the skiing on hard packed you get here, plus the powder I am hoping to do a bit of in France, these are the best two. Both are nice and stiff to handle our hard packed (the Volkl marginally stiffer), can bust through things and wide enough in the tip to suit the powder.

    The negative on both is not great if you want to do tight mogul turns. I am a long way from mastering these so I will need to check I can handle the skis when say dropping under Kosi chair or the catwalk to do the bumps under that lip.

    Other options include:

    Head Intelligence - 171cm long, 14.6m radius, 124-78-110. Not sure how it compares with stiffness, a bit shorter (might come in a 176cm) and a bit narrower in the waist. You trade off the shorter turns for not quite being as good in soft stuff.

    JD seeing as you are similar weight and have the Elans, how do you like them? I'm sure you would be a better skier.

    Thanks guys by the way.

  5. #5

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    Dont be so sure about the better skier thing, I look as gumby in bumps as the next guy!

    The Elan M666's are a pretty good ski. They hold a good edge and charge the crud pretty well, although after last season they looked quite second hand, but Paul did a great job of rebirthing them.

    I am a little concerned that you are looking for a 70-30 ski but people are recommending 82mm under foot. I would have thought that a 70-76mm ski would be more appropriate. I didn't realise the mag 14 was so wide!

    I would also be looking at shorter for your weight, around 168-170cm. The ski does not know how tall you are! You will also find these better in the bumps.

    I suggest looking a tad narrower for your needs. From all reports the Stoecklis are a good unit, and I believe Paul has some Fischer AMC73's that might be pretty good for you too (and cheap!!)

    maybe the odd Demo could be in order, but IMHO theres enough good info floating around here to tell you what you need to know!
    *insert witty comment here*

  6. #6
    james
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    Shorter skis for my weight? At 88kgs, I would have thought I was heavier then most!

    I was actually looking for more the 171-172cm length, rather than 177cm. It just might make things that little bit easier in bumps.

    Also, with my skis having a 64mm waist, even at 76-78mm it is a big improvement.

  7. #7
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    as an idea... i'm 100 give or take and ski a 164...
    Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in beer!

  8. #8
    james
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    what height rednut? Don't both matter?

  9. #9

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    Originally posted by james:
    Shorter skis for my weight? At 88kgs, I would have thought I was heavier then most!

    I was actually looking for more the 171-172cm length, rather than 177cm. It just might make things that little bit easier in bumps.

    Also, with my skis having a 64mm waist, even at 76-78mm it is a big improvement.
    172 would be the longest I would go and I weigh 90kg, unless looking for an off piste or BC ski.

    My Elans are 167, they are fine, I could get away with 164's, gone are the days of the 215's for piste skiing!

    I reckon a 76mm under foot ski with a 15-17m radius is an excellent all rounder, too much fatter and you lose the speed from edge to edge on groomers, too much thinner and you get buried in the pow unless your charging (some like to be buried in the pow!)

    The skis I demo'd in Atomic were Mteron 11's, I looked them up, not great on an edge, but may not have had the factory tune still.
    *insert witty comment here*

  10. #10
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    i believe height isn't such an issue these days as weight... but i'm only 172ish
    Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in beer!

  11. #11

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    I am 176cm tall. Height is rather more secondary to weight. Paul O is over 6 foot and pretty sure he skis 167 Fischers.
    *insert witty comment here*

  12. #12

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    It might be an idea to demo if your not sure on length, but I reckon around 170cm is the mark!
    *insert witty comment here*

  13. #13
    azkaban
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    Originally posted by John Deere:


    Another could be the K2 Apache range ......
    I agree John. If you want something more on piste than off piste the Apache Crossfires might be the go. Narrower underfoot than you want (70)but supposed to be great On piste and able to go off as well. If you are after something more 50/50 check out the Apache recon.

  14. #14
    james
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    thanks again guys.

    It seems the Head Intelligence (171cms, 14.6m radius and 78mm under foot) and the Volkl AC3 (170cms, 16.7m radius and 76 under foot) could be the best bet. And I think I can demo last season's version of that Volkl ski.

    Anyone skied much on Head and Volkl skis and know how well they hold their edge? I'm not so keen on Salomons or Atomics at this stage. Volkl I am told are always a very good ski. The same person highly recommended Head Monsters.

  15. #15

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    Originally posted by james:
    Yeah I don't reckon my atomics hold a great edge, but I don't have a lot to compare them with.

    Readers recommended the following two - close to what you guys are saying

    Elan Magfire 14/Magfire Pro - 126-82-109, radius 17.2, 176cm long.

    Volkl AC 40 - 125-82-110 radius 17.8 177cm long.
    I owned and skiied last years Volkl AC4, I own the Volkl AC3 from 2 seasons ago, last years Stockli Stormrider XL and I'm purchasing this years Stormrider XXL.

    My thoughs:

    Volkl AC40 - unless Volkl have significantly softened the AC40 (similar to the original from 2005), I would not recommend it. Last years ski was very stiff and required a big and strong skier to ski it (designed for obese Americans). Reviews suggest that the AC4/AC40 is a phat Allstar. It has a lot of sidecut which will demand good carve technique. That will also make it hookey in deep snowand not so good in moguls, where you will want to release the edges and pivot rather than carve.

    Elan Magfire - haven't skiied an Elan since Stenmark was winning the World Cup, so I cannot comment. I understad JD likes them, so listen to his comments.

    On my skis:

    Volkl AC3/AC30 - narrower than the AC4/AC40 and IMO more suited to Oz conditions than the AC4/AC40. Similar comments on the 2006 AC3 i.e was stiffend up for obese Americans. If this yeasr AC30 is like the original AC3 (2005 orange coloured ski). IMO ski it short. Im 185cm/85kg and ski it at 170cm. Fast great edge hold, can swing short turns with lots of rebound.

    Stockli Stormrider XL - very simialr to my AC3, only smoother and with more finesse. I ski this at 174cm. As Nutter will testify, Stocklis are an addictive ski, they should come with a wealth warning. Do not try these skis unless you are prepared to buy them

    Stockli Stormrider XXL - Came very close to skiing the only pair in Oz on Friday. Fatter brother to the XL, nice and light, smooth flex. The importer said they were like a rally car that needed to be driven hard and fast to get the most out of them. Love GS turns at warp speed in any snow condition. They seem awsome and I cannot wait to get my hands on them when they arrive (I have ordered a pair of 186cm as a BC ski).

    Hope that helps.

    [size="1"][ 04.07.2007, 08:25 AM: Message edited by: Taxman ][/size]
    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

  16. #16
    Silence
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    ^ FYI - spoke to the volkl rep the other day and the AC30 has been softened in tip&tail. I'll assume for the moment the same was done with the AC40

    i know what you mean about them both being very stiff

  17. #17
    james
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    Thanks again guys.

    I had a look at the AC3 in Paul Readers. They have them at 170cm and they have a waist of 76mm and a radius of 16.7m. They might be worth a try but with me being upper intermediate trying to move into advanced, I worry that they might be tough for me to handle in tighter turns while I am at this standard. I do want them for a few years and expect to do around 25-30 days next year, so they should be better for me to handle as I improve. The only way to see how I can handle them now is to try them I guess.

    I really don't like my atomic SX7s on the hard packed Aussie snow though.

    I looked around the internet at the head monsters and this seemed to be the most suitable of them for me. I guess I'd look at it at 170cm and would love to try one.

    All the skis, with the wider waist than what I have, will take more work with the shorter turns when I need them, but I will need to try them to see how I go.

    Head Monster i.M 75 Super Railflex II

    Wider than the iM70, the iM75 has more grunt through variable conditions. Smooth in soft snow and absolutely stable on ice. Its width provides the lift needed in powder, while its sidecut guarantees top carving on groomed slopes.

    Lengths: 156, 163, 170, 177
    Radius: [email protected]
    Sidecut: 114/74/103

    I wonder what the difference is between a head monster using the intelligence features (so says the blurb on the im70) and the head intelligence skis. The Head Intelligence is 10mm wider in the tip and 4mm wider in the waist and has a tighter radius at 14.6m.

    The Head Monsters come highly recommended by someone I have skied with a bit who knows his stuff.

    Don't know much about stoecklis and haven't seen them in the shops I've been to. Are they a real top of the range ski?

  18. #18
    Snowatch Patrol Rednut's Avatar
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    they are a hand made swiss ski...

    www.stoeckli.ch

    www.snowbizz.com.au - australian distributor
    Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in beer!

  19. #19
    SA
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    I've skied some Head Monsters - iM82.

    Very nice ski, but that width was more suitable for off-piste.

    Another thing - while I really enjoyed the Mag 10s and X-Wing Tornado, they have a quite small turn radius. I thought it could allow me to be a lazy skier in that I could ski short radius turns almost solely by laying the ski over and riding its sidecut, as opposed to actually having to bend and steer the ski as well. Something to think about if you're looking to advance...

  20. #20

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    James, Stockli skis come with a wealth warning - They are addictive and trying them will cause you to buy them.

    Drop into Snowbizz at Jindabyne (Nuggets Crossing behind the Bakery) and get a pair to demo. Nutter and I are stoked with our Stormrider XLs, which could be a good choice for you. Also look at the Rotor, a twin tip that gets good reviews.

    BTW, if you do get hooked, talk to Paul before buying, he can usually get a better price.
    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

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