Where to ski in Japan Feb 2011?

[LifesGood]

Which resorts are the best for families with small children? We will have our 4y/o daughter with us and will probably put her into ski school for 2 or 3 days. +1 and I are intermediate, on-piste skiers.

Is Niseko our best bet? Or somewhere else?

We need to consider things like how close to the ski area accommodation is, and whether self-contained is an option (preferred), also what is the transfer time from Narita.

Any other tips appreciated.

[blutek]

Niseko has the infrastructure you require. It's about 1 hour flight and 2hr+ bus connection (depending on the weather).
Having said that, Hakuba may be a better choice for a 4yo, as it will not be as cold. Niseko can be snowing every day or windy & you may not see the sun.

[LifesGood]

Thanks Blutek, I just found another thread here on a similar topic and I think I will research Niseko and Hakuba.

We thought we might stop in Tokyo/surrounds for a few days and then travel on to the resort, then do a bit more sightseeing afterwards. Any tips on must-not-miss sightseeing in Japan?

In terms of ski resorts, a big factor will also be what the ski-school is like for the 4y/o. She has done a couple of days last season in Thredbo and will do more this season, but she will still be quite new to it all.

It's very exciting just thinking about it!

[blutek]

Expect Niseko to be about 5 degrees colder than Hakuba. Both have ski schools in English.
In Tokyo - layer, as shops & trains can be quite hot when outdoors is very cold (hats, gloves & coats - on & off all the time). Most stay in Shinjuku or Shibuya, but the rail network is so good, it really doesn't matter. Avoid trains in peak hours. Get a good understanding (and map) of the Metro & JR networks
Lots of Tokyo information here: http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2164.html
Hmm, onpiste skiers, that could change.

[pboards&mskis]

Hmm, onpiste skiers, that could change.[/QUOTE]

Agree with Bluetek on this one.... Went to Niseko as a dedicated blue groomer skier. Had a lesson with booked through NAC, and the instructor took me into powder and into trees. Best thing I ever did for my skiing was that lesson.....Worst thing is that now a blue groomer just won't do - now I want powder! ;)

[LifesGood]

More than happy to become a competent off-piste skier! At the moment I am just a good off-piste face-planter.

Might have to make that one of my goals in Japan :)

[Podlettte]

I did lessons with NISS (think it is/was run by Aussies) to learn to ski powder, my first OS experience of it (2007) and they have a milo kids club and the kids wear green milo bibs just like here.

I went to Hakuba this year and the only real difference is if you want ease of getting around with Miss 4 and your skis in the morning in hakuba then pick your accommodation so you are right near the lifts where the lessons start from (think it's the Sakka lifts at Happo One, but you'll have to check I didn't have any lessons in Hak).

The niseko village is far more compact and easier to get around as it's basically split into 2 main areas, Pensione area (below the main road) and the hotel and food area (above the main road). There's a free skier shuttle running all day and at night everything is a 5-10 minute walk away.

In Hak I found it very confusing and we accidentally got on the wrong bus one night and spent a painful hour waiting to get back to where we started and missed out dinner booking urgh! Of course, you might not find it confusing, but I found I was paying money everytime we wanted to go out to eat just to get there, whereas Niseko was easy walking distance, or a bus into Kutchan for something different, so much simpler IMO.

[Altheau]

if you are going to tokyo with the littlies, consider a trip to studio ghibli museum

we went as I love studio ghibli movies (spirited away, totoro, hals moving castle) and it was lovley, very child orientated

we went there via a train, you basically get off the train and there are little signs all the way to the museum.

we winged it and managed to find someone in a lawson (where you buy the tickets in Japan) who spoke english, but it was hit and miss, we were lucky.

they have some info about tickets etc on their website here (http://www.ghibli-museum.jp/en/ticket_information/)

[LifesGood]

That's fantastic info, thanks Podlette and Altheau.

Another question - we are probably not going to be able to book for another few months yet - how late is too late to get decent accommodation? And will the internal flights get booked out 6 months in advance? This trip will be the first leg of a move to the UK for a couple of years, so we have a few things to sort out before we can definitely book.

[Podlettte]

For my 2007 trip I booked in December for a February trip, and for our recent Feb trip we booked in Late December, it was a last minute thing, and into January.

With regard to the flights, I've honestly got no idea, we booked out internal flights when we booked our international leg (on JAL).

JAL flights are direct, as are most QF flights, all JQ flights go via goldy or cairns - with littlies it's either great as it breaks the flight up, or it's a nightmare as you are lugging your gear from domestic to International, different terminals in Cairns, which even just for us was a PIA in Cairns!

If you aren't flying in Japan on a public holiday or during any of the special things like the Snow and Ice festival in Sapporo (hokkaido) then I'd think you would be ok to get last minute flights. the snow and ice festival is HUGE and accom closest to the ice sculpture location in Sapporo might even be almost booked out now, however if you want to overnight there you'd get some a little further away from the main CBD that's on the train line

[LifesGood]

That's reassuring Podlette, thankyou. We are intending to fly JAL premium economy which will leave I think at 9am AEST.

[SA]

I had no problems booking for the Snow/Ice Festival in September last year, if that's any help. That was next to the ice sculpture area in Susukino, and about 7 minutes walk to Odori Park.

Re: Niseko village - just be aware that they did a renaming a few years ago, Niseko Village is what they used to call Niseko Higashiyama, which is the next area over from Grand Hirafu. The majority of the accomodation is at Hirafu - which is what the rest of Pod's post was about.

You can get JQ flights through Gold Coast that don't require you to pick up/re-check luggage.

[Crystal]

If you choose Niseko there are many ski schools there. I did the ground work last December and we ended up using the NBS ski school over NISS. Our little one loved the school and it was in a great location (bottom of family chair) rather than making the hike or catching the bus to the NISS school. they have a chef that cooks for the kids when in full day ski school and the food is great. Our little one dosent eat much at the best of times but ate heaps at ski school including ramens.

If you want any more details on NBS let me know.

Accom in Niseko is pretty spread out and i would go for something near the base of the family lift. If you are made of $$$ go the Vale.

Don't stress about the cold for the little ones, they are fine once geared up and ski in sheltered areas when nasty.

[Altheau]

Crystal brings up a good point I did not think about. When I went to Hakuba with +1 i had never skiied before. We did not really think about lessons etc until we got there and evergreen was booked solid for the whole week, skiing and boarding. I managed to get a lesson at the Japanses ski school, they had a few english speaking instructors.

So if you want a lesson with evergreen then book early as they are very popular (if you are going to hakuba that is)

[Bear]

I booked the +1 into evergreen about a month out of getting to Hakuba so it wasn't an issue. I think if you just rock up you can have issues like Altheau.

[LifesGood]

Crystal - I like the sound of the convenience of the NBS - we are hopelessly slow in the mornings, all three of us, so if it is close then that will help. I will check out the Vale and other accommodation near to there. Where is NISS located?

I can't thank everyone enough for all your help, I feel like I have enough tips to start some research now, rather than a great black hole of unknowns. Once we have worked out what we are doing I will head over and check out the 'who will be in Japan' thread so maybe we can catch up with some of you.

Does anyone have tips on good online booking agents to use?

[Podlettte]

I didn't use an agent, I did it all for myself and my sister and this year for me and my fiance.

NISS is located at the base of the King pair lift in Hirafu which you can see on this map at E1 + F 1 -

http://www.travelplan.com.au/verve/_resources/Hirafu_Village_map_2010.pdf

[LifesGood]

Sorry, I meant how did you choose/book your accommodation?

[Crystal]

LifesGood, as Pod says the NISS school is at the top of the village and pretty much you have to get a shuttle bus there, they do run frequently but can be full at peak times and they just go past. You will not do that walk with a 4 year old in ski boots I can assure you. The NBS ski school is at bus stop 11 I think and the Hanazono shuttle bus stops there....so often it is empty and you can jump on it.

I use Travelplan to book my OS trips, last year we went with a Japan based mob (as we were travelling in a larger group), they are okay but I would only reccomend Travelplan.

If you need more info about Niseko...based around young kids and stuff let me know.

[Podlettte]

I booked directly with the place we stayed, and chose the place just from it's price and looking at it on the web. I'd asked for recommendations from others over at another site, but no one had stayed there, so took a punt and it turned out great.

for the rest of our tripping around Hokkaido we'd booked some and just winged it for the rest, but it was 2 single people no kids, much easier to wing it when kids aren't involved (peace of mind etc)

[Jahoota]

Have you looked at rutsutsu? It also seems to have a range of family freindly options for littlies (and not so littlies). I cant actually recommend it however as Ive never been.

[Crystal]

We did a few days at Rutsutsu and absolutey loved it, we didn't take the kids though and chose to leave them with the nanny. I would however be happy to spend some time there with the family. Very well set out, great facilites, easy to get around and awesome riding. I would not however stay there past 7 days as there is not a village/town close by so limited eating places and hard to get to supermarket to self cater (which is very important with children).

[pboards&mskis]

We stayed in Rusutsu for 4 nights (but without kids) in Jan 2008. It has heaps of activities for kids and is really aimed at Japanese families. THey hada 3D movie theatre, games room, singing tree, merry-go-round, wave pool and other bits for kids inside the hotel. We loved it as big kids ourselves. But Crystal is right, there is very little other than a convenience store for self-catering/ other meal options. I did note however, that the child care center would cater for kids as young as 6 months. Rusutsu also has the benefit of most accommodation being the linked to the ski hill, and easy ski in/ski out access. So no shuttle bus required. Although, there are increasingly more accom options being built there. The ski school there was pretty good too, and had some instructors with really good english, my instructor had spent a couple of seasons in NZ and was able to instruct in ski, board and telemark.

Same trip, we stayed in Niseko at Higashiyama for 5 nights. Although the hotel there is great for ski in/ski out, it is a $30 taxi ride into Hirafu if you want to go to dinner and don't want to get the bus (or just miss it!). Also, a lot of the lessons / backcountry guiding start at 8.30 at Hirafu and it used to be impossible to get there early enough on the bus, or to get the gondola up and ski across in time. Hirafu has all the food options, and transport is less of an issue.

This year we went to Hakuba and Nozawa Onsen. Nozawa has lots of up hill walking but is a great little town. Hakuba has great skiing, but the buses are a bit confusing (as previously mentioned). I'd recommend staying in the centre of Hakuba either near the "ADAM" gondola or near the Sakka lift. As long as you are on the purple "loopbus" shuttle route, you'll be fine. We stayed out in Echoland, and getting the bus was a bit of a drag, and tended to get very crowded in peak times. Also, I organised a lesson through Evergreen at short notice and had no issue with availability for 2 days ahead, and this was in late January, after schools had gone back.

[LifesGood]

Me again:rolleyes:

Based on all of the feedback here and my research I think we will try Niseko as a first-timer holiday.

I have sent off a few requests for quotes and so far I have two quotes for stays at:

Vale Hotel 1.5 b/r apt 5 nights $2,918
First Tracks - 2 b/r 5 nights JPY264,800 (approx A$3,000) or 7 nights JPY370,720 (approx A$4,200)

While these prices sound reasonable when I compare them with 5 nights in Thredbo Village, do they sound ok to others who have been to Niseko? We can't buy a package with airfares as we are going one-way to the UK so I'm concerned that we may be missing out on the best prices. The prices don't include transfers or anything else (I think).

Feedback appreciated.

[SA]

Can't really comment on price; but perhaps try enquiring directly with Hokkaido Tracks (they manage First Tracks, or used to).

Stayed at First Tracks just after they were built - excellent apartments, well located to the Ace Pair and close to the main street (one street over).

[LifesGood]

Thanks SA, that quote was from Hokkaido Tracks.

[blutek]

Fresh Powder apartments should be cheaper (around 200,000y for the 1 bedroom) .
Also consider a Japanese hotel with breakfast & onsen included. A better cultural experience & a chance to practice some basic Japanese words maybe. Checkout the Kogen, Alpen or J First Hotel which are very well located.

[Vet]

:

Vale Hotel 1.5 b/r apt 5 nights $2,918
First Tracks - 2 b/r 7 nights JPY370,720 (approx A$4,200)

Feedback appreciated.

$A7k for accomodation only???

IIRC, posters over the last few years said they averaged about $2k to $3k pp for air, accom and lifts and maybe meals as well. I think it was still around that in recent months for those who grabbed Jetstar's $500 to $700 Return airfares. But it went to $4k pp, iirc, when the $A crashed as against the yen, and people walked away from their deposits.

[Crystal]

I would pick accom based on availablilty to lifts for the kids and suck up the price. If you use NBS ski school, you NEED to be near the Family chair. If you use NISS you need to be at the top of the village say at the Hotel Alpen.

Have you tried Ski Japan for a quote.

[Mizu Kuma]

LG,
went to Niseko 09 season, the aussie was gettin us about 50 yen and at most cost us AU4,500pp staying at Ishi in Izumikyo 1 which is about 200 meters to everything yet set in a very quiet area of Hirafu. The price included Acc Lifts Transfers and Air (Narita to Haneda transfers not inc but approx AU60pp at that time). This was for 9 nights with 7 day lift. 5 star acc.

Tips imo
stay in Hirafu
pre book restuarants if there in peak
take face protection for on the mountain
invest in some cleats for apres around town (icy = slippery)
eat as many different foods you can (oyshee!)
learn some basic Japanese and ALWAYS be polite and show respect/manners
if you can stop over in Tokyo for a couple of nights that would be advised, as the flights, even for an adult (big kid), knocks it out of you, let alone the little ones.

oh yeah, and you will have one of the BEST EXPERIENCES of your life!

sorry (first time user)

Try Alpine World or Ski Japan, as they have support in Hirafu if there is any dramas......

[ausi ski bum]

Personally if I had young kids I would not ski in Niseko, the village is not that easy to get around unless your close to the lifts, I would ski at Rusutsu, Tomamu or Sahoro where they all have great resort accommodation right in the ski area.

All three of them also have a mixture of slopes from easy to advanced and the accommodation options are excellent, they are generally very reasonable with a little research, Japanican for example is one of the better sites to bok accommodation at much lower prices than most of the agents.

Flying, around June - July you will most likely see some good offeres, Jet* via the Gold Coast into Osaka or Tokyo is a good option, I use Osaka as there is no need to transfer from Narita to Heneda to fly on to Saporro, sure there are a few flights from Narita but in generall they are not the cheaper option.

You cant book flights from Tokyo or Osaka until three months out unless you fly JAL all the way.

[Crystal]

I tend to agree with ASB...... with young kids Niseko...NO. And we did it in Jan. There are many more places in Japan that would suit better it just depends on the budget.

[blutek]

I don't have young kids (now grown up), but I would think the facitiies for child care in Niseko (or Sahoro Club Med resort ), would offer services in English. Other areas may only speak Japanese.

[Crystal]

blutek, that's not the issue most kids are great with childcare and dosen't matter about the language...teach them a few key words and they are set.. It's the village lay out, icy walkways and the shuttle buses